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Looks like we finally got our round 3 prompt freeze. Any prompts people are looked to fill or be filled?
Honestly, with the way fandom reacts to certain things about Finn/Poe, I bet some people are worried about being called out for racism. I've already seen it happen once or twice.
AYRT
Sorry, I should have specified - I meant that Disney taking the reins hasn't suddenly made the Marvel movies more watered down. The bad guys still got defeated and the good guys still saved the day before Disney got involved. They're superhero films and, unlike several other superhero franchises, they're not grim and gritty. That tone hasn't changed since Disney bought Marvel, and my point (that I didn't articulate well, sorry about that) is that the Star Wars tone hasn't suddenly been completely overhauled since Disney bought it.
The SW films have always been enjoyable as family films. Sure, they're skewed much older than an animated Disney film, but kids do love them. And I think TFA fit into that mold nicely. Like you say, Han's death would likely hit older audiences more strongly than younger audiences - the movies aren't suddenly only about children and their enjoyment, they're still primarily focused on telling a story everyone can appreciate. One of the bigger complaints about The Phantom Menace (amongst many, many complaints) was that between introducing Anakin at such a young age and Jar Jar's childlike personality, it seemed obvious that Lucas was trying to aim for a younger audience. I didn't get that sense at all from TFA. The closest thing to a merchandise-friendly character that children would automatically adore is BB-8, but the same could be said about R2-D2 in the original trilogy.
I do think they'll look into Kylo Ren's motivations and that could possibly involve some sort of redemption arc for him. But that's mainly because that's an established SW pattern, not because Disney have to make him a good guy because of toy sales. The PT was about Anakin's fall to the Dark Side, the OT has Palpatine and Vader trying to pull Luke to the Dark Side too, and ultimately failing, thus leading to Vader's sacrifice to save Luke. I think we'll see something similar, with a juxtaposition between Rey having to fight the temptation of the Dark Side and Kylo having to fight the temptation of the Light. They've already humanised Kylo in TFA more than Vader was for most of the OT, so it'd be a wasted opportunity not to explore his inner conflict. I think it's more likely any act Kylo takes against Snoke and the Dark Side will be fuelled more by personal revenge than wanting to help the Resistance. Whether he actually will end up being fully 'redeemed' is a mystery, obviously, but I don't see him getting a happy ending either way.
I don't think including the Netflix shows make sense with the comparison I was trying to make, but again that's my fault for not being clear. The MCU movies remained the same in tone when Disney took over, the SW movies remained the same in tone when Disney took over. Now, the spin-offs from the movie will be where it gets interesting. The Clone Wars cartoon may have started out cheery and kid-friendly, but it got deeply dark and complicated by the end. Disney cancelled the show, but they've been quite clear that it wasn't the tone that was the problem, it's that they're trying to move away from the PT era and focus more on OT era and beyond. Rebels is on Disney XD, so that has to remain a certain level of family-friendly, but already the second season is considerably darker than the first. I think the most comparable thing to the Marvel Netflix shows will be the SW Anthology movies, since they can create their own tone and style without having to fit with the rest of the SW films. That doesn't necessarily mean grim and gritty, but it does mean a stylistic change, and that's where a potential comparison could lie.
To be fair, I don't think you can say Vader being a mass murderer and child-killer is "glossed over". Yes, he dies doing a noble thing, but the last five minutes of ROTJ don't suddenly invalidate the rest of the OT, or his fall in ROTS. Vader as a mass-murderer very much is focused on in the movies, it's literally his entire role for most of the OT. He's the villain, he murders and kidnaps and tortures main characters. And when we find out he's related to Luke, it's because he's trying to use that fact to turn Luke to the Dark Side. When people think of Vader, whether they're casual or diehard fans, their first thought is going to be him as the villain of the saga, not "oh, he did a good thing at the end, so none of the rest of his evil shit matters".
Sorry, I should have specified - I meant that Disney taking the reins hasn't suddenly made the Marvel movies more watered down. The bad guys still got defeated and the good guys still saved the day before Disney got involved. They're superhero films and, unlike several other superhero franchises, they're not grim and gritty. That tone hasn't changed since Disney bought Marvel, and my point (that I didn't articulate well, sorry about that) is that the Star Wars tone hasn't suddenly been completely overhauled since Disney bought it.
The SW films have always been enjoyable as family films. Sure, they're skewed much older than an animated Disney film, but kids do love them. And I think TFA fit into that mold nicely. Like you say, Han's death would likely hit older audiences more strongly than younger audiences - the movies aren't suddenly only about children and their enjoyment, they're still primarily focused on telling a story everyone can appreciate. One of the bigger complaints about The Phantom Menace (amongst many, many complaints) was that between introducing Anakin at such a young age and Jar Jar's childlike personality, it seemed obvious that Lucas was trying to aim for a younger audience. I didn't get that sense at all from TFA. The closest thing to a merchandise-friendly character that children would automatically adore is BB-8, but the same could be said about R2-D2 in the original trilogy.
I do think they'll look into Kylo Ren's motivations and that could possibly involve some sort of redemption arc for him. But that's mainly because that's an established SW pattern, not because Disney have to make him a good guy because of toy sales. The PT was about Anakin's fall to the Dark Side, the OT has Palpatine and Vader trying to pull Luke to the Dark Side too, and ultimately failing, thus leading to Vader's sacrifice to save Luke. I think we'll see something similar, with a juxtaposition between Rey having to fight the temptation of the Dark Side and Kylo having to fight the temptation of the Light. They've already humanised Kylo in TFA more than Vader was for most of the OT, so it'd be a wasted opportunity not to explore his inner conflict. I think it's more likely any act Kylo takes against Snoke and the Dark Side will be fuelled more by personal revenge than wanting to help the Resistance. Whether he actually will end up being fully 'redeemed' is a mystery, obviously, but I don't see him getting a happy ending either way.
I don't think including the Netflix shows make sense with the comparison I was trying to make, but again that's my fault for not being clear. The MCU movies remained the same in tone when Disney took over, the SW movies remained the same in tone when Disney took over. Now, the spin-offs from the movie will be where it gets interesting. The Clone Wars cartoon may have started out cheery and kid-friendly, but it got deeply dark and complicated by the end. Disney cancelled the show, but they've been quite clear that it wasn't the tone that was the problem, it's that they're trying to move away from the PT era and focus more on OT era and beyond. Rebels is on Disney XD, so that has to remain a certain level of family-friendly, but already the second season is considerably darker than the first. I think the most comparable thing to the Marvel Netflix shows will be the SW Anthology movies, since they can create their own tone and style without having to fit with the rest of the SW films. That doesn't necessarily mean grim and gritty, but it does mean a stylistic change, and that's where a potential comparison could lie.
To be fair, I don't think you can say Vader being a mass murderer and child-killer is "glossed over". Yes, he dies doing a noble thing, but the last five minutes of ROTJ don't suddenly invalidate the rest of the OT, or his fall in ROTS. Vader as a mass-murderer very much is focused on in the movies, it's literally his entire role for most of the OT. He's the villain, he murders and kidnaps and tortures main characters. And when we find out he's related to Luke, it's because he's trying to use that fact to turn Luke to the Dark Side. When people think of Vader, whether they're casual or diehard fans, their first thought is going to be him as the villain of the saga, not "oh, he did a good thing at the end, so none of the rest of his evil shit matters".
DA
A part of me thinks they won't kill Rhodey, because they showed him obviously hurt and unconscious in the trailer, so it wouldn't be much of a surprise. The other part of me remembers that shot of Wanda screaming in the AOU trailer and how obvious it made it that Pietro was going to die. There's also the fact that RDJ was told he could have either Pepper or Rhodey in AOU and he chose Rhodey, and the MCU has a history of allowing characters to have small parts in multiple films so their eventual death can be more of a manpain motivator.
Having Steve die and come back would seem cheap in the movies. I mean, I know shit like that happens all the time in comics, but the movies are different and audiences would probably be more resistant to the idea. Having Steve be so badly injured that he's in a coma and not waking up anytime soon would probably work better. Or having the other characters think he's dead, only to show Hydra or Ross or whoever has his body and is experimenting might work. I don't know, I just don't want straight 'he's totally dead ... until it's convenient for the plot of the next movie' to happen. It was crappy with Coulson on Agents Of SHIELD, it'd be crappy in the movies.
A part of me thinks they won't kill Rhodey, because they showed him obviously hurt and unconscious in the trailer, so it wouldn't be much of a surprise. The other part of me remembers that shot of Wanda screaming in the AOU trailer and how obvious it made it that Pietro was going to die. There's also the fact that RDJ was told he could have either Pepper or Rhodey in AOU and he chose Rhodey, and the MCU has a history of allowing characters to have small parts in multiple films so their eventual death can be more of a manpain motivator.
Having Steve die and come back would seem cheap in the movies. I mean, I know shit like that happens all the time in comics, but the movies are different and audiences would probably be more resistant to the idea. Having Steve be so badly injured that he's in a coma and not waking up anytime soon would probably work better. Or having the other characters think he's dead, only to show Hydra or Ross or whoever has his body and is experimenting might work. I don't know, I just don't want straight 'he's totally dead ... until it's convenient for the plot of the next movie' to happen. It was crappy with Coulson on Agents Of SHIELD, it'd be crappy in the movies.
Second. I am going home for the weekend and I should have some time for short fills.
I find the backseat mods a lot more annoying than everything else. That and the one who think are clever by pointing out errors in the OPs post, be it a grammar error or to try and be PC, this is a kink meme people aren't here to write an English paper or solve the worlds' social problems. Shut up and enjoy the smut.
DA
Agreed. So hard. The whole 'you think this is bad? Well, other people have it worse' thing never helps any conversation. If people are frustrated by the wank here, then they're frustrated by the wank here, other memes and areas of fandom aren't a factor.
Agreed. So hard. The whole 'you think this is bad? Well, other people have it worse' thing never helps any conversation. If people are frustrated by the wank here, then they're frustrated by the wank here, other memes and areas of fandom aren't a factor.
Had an interesting discussion with a friend over IM about filling anon kinkmeme prompts, was wondering what peoples' take is:
When I post anon prompts, I'm usually spinning off a pretty vague idea. Stuff like "What if everyone was in a fairy tale" or "I just want to see [character] bottoming for once" or "Your OT3 gets ahold of some sex dice." It's usually a whim that I expect fillers to do something innovative with. Likewise, when I fill a prompt, I see it as a base to build on. If it sparks an idea in me I'll run with it, even if it doesn't include every detail from the prompt or goes in an unexpected direction.
My friend is an avid challenge writer (think Yuletide), and sees prompts as requests similar to Yuletide. She enjoys the challenge of the constraints. Her number one priority in filling a prompt is making sure that the original prompter gets exactly what they wanted out of it, even if there's something she'd change if she was writing it for herself.
I'm certainly not saying that either position is the "right" or "wrong" way to do it, but it's interesting to me that we have such different ideas about how to think about these prompts.
When you prompt something, what do you expect? When you fill a prompt, what do you strive for?
When I post anon prompts, I'm usually spinning off a pretty vague idea. Stuff like "What if everyone was in a fairy tale" or "I just want to see [character] bottoming for once" or "Your OT3 gets ahold of some sex dice." It's usually a whim that I expect fillers to do something innovative with. Likewise, when I fill a prompt, I see it as a base to build on. If it sparks an idea in me I'll run with it, even if it doesn't include every detail from the prompt or goes in an unexpected direction.
My friend is an avid challenge writer (think Yuletide), and sees prompts as requests similar to Yuletide. She enjoys the challenge of the constraints. Her number one priority in filling a prompt is making sure that the original prompter gets exactly what they wanted out of it, even if there's something she'd change if she was writing it for herself.
I'm certainly not saying that either position is the "right" or "wrong" way to do it, but it's interesting to me that we have such different ideas about how to think about these prompts.
When you prompt something, what do you expect? When you fill a prompt, what do you strive for?
I'm crying, anon. That's dedication!
I'm desperately hoping that someone else fills the following:
http://tfa-kink.dreamwidth.org/2821.html?thread=4575749#cmt4575749 Leia/Ben incest
http://tfa-kink.dreamwidth.org/2821.html?thread=4865541#cmt4865541 Leia/Ben/Han incest
http://tfa-kink.dreamwidth.org/2821.html?thread=5177861#cmt5177861
Hanging with Uncle Lando
http://tfa-kink.dreamwidth.org/2821.html?thread=4632837#cmt4632837 wandering through minds
http://tfa-kink.dreamwidth.org/2821.html?thread=5180677#cmt5180677
Modern AU OT6 meets canon characters
They're not my prompts, but I was thinking of filling them and then going, "You know, I don't really have a good idea for these, I just want to see how they HAPPEN."
http://tfa-kink.dreamwidth.org/2821.html?thread=4575749#cmt4575749 Leia/Ben incest
http://tfa-kink.dreamwidth.org/2821.html?thread=4865541#cmt4865541 Leia/Ben/Han incest
http://tfa-kink.dreamwidth.org/2821.html?thread=5177861#cmt5177861
Hanging with Uncle Lando
http://tfa-kink.dreamwidth.org/2821.html?thread=4632837#cmt4632837 wandering through minds
http://tfa-kink.dreamwidth.org/2821.html?thread=5180677#cmt5180677
Modern AU OT6 meets canon characters
They're not my prompts, but I was thinking of filling them and then going, "You know, I don't really have a good idea for these, I just want to see how they HAPPEN."
Me too. I just can't read pairings where everything is sunshine and roses between the two (or three) characters. Even my one OTP (in another fandom) where they're actually friends and love each other has a strong undercurrent of rivalry and tension to it.
Someone was forced to delete their story on AO3 because they dared to write a dark sex pollen story for Finn/Poe and brought in Tumblr's "that's racist" crowd.
So I completely get you. This fandom is ridiculous. Ironically this hyper sensitive SJW are only forcing people to move towards other ships with their constant censorship and progressive thinking, and in this case the one "safe" ship with two white dudes on it, which is what THEY didn't want in the first place.
At this point I am ready to move towards Kylo/Hux too because I love my dark angsty stories and apparently that would make me a racist.
So I completely get you. This fandom is ridiculous. Ironically this hyper sensitive SJW are only forcing people to move towards other ships with their constant censorship and progressive thinking, and in this case the one "safe" ship with two white dudes on it, which is what THEY didn't want in the first place.
At this point I am ready to move towards Kylo/Hux too because I love my dark angsty stories and apparently that would make me a racist.
I enjoy a mix of both tbh.
There are some prompts where I do want certain things. But overall I enjoy being surprised.
Same when I fill.
There are some prompts where I do want certain things. But overall I enjoy being surprised.
Same when I fill.
I mean, not in so many words. He's just the viewpoint I like to read, and I like to read that expressed in a certain way.
Probably that says something.
Probably that says something.
Wait, they had to delete a Finn/Poe fic because it wasn't happy fluff?! Because it featured a kink trope that wasn't vanilla enough?! That's messed up.
I'm pretty sure the people screaming the loudest about racism and how not shipping fluffy Stormpilot makes you a terrible person are the same people who shrieked about how it wasn't racist to desexualise Sam Wilson and claim he's 'just too good for anyone' in their headcanon posts about Stucky. Now they're finally shipping something other than two white dudes, they're going overboard to prove they totally weren't being racist before, honest you guys!!1! And their overcompensation is so fucking loud it's becoming the fandom baseline for dealing with Stormpilot, which sucks. They don't actually care about race in fandom, it's just about proving their own fandom credentials, and ultimately they're damaging any discussion that actually does focus on race issues.
I'm pretty sure the people screaming the loudest about racism and how not shipping fluffy Stormpilot makes you a terrible person are the same people who shrieked about how it wasn't racist to desexualise Sam Wilson and claim he's 'just too good for anyone' in their headcanon posts about Stucky. Now they're finally shipping something other than two white dudes, they're going overboard to prove they totally weren't being racist before, honest you guys!!1! And their overcompensation is so fucking loud it's becoming the fandom baseline for dealing with Stormpilot, which sucks. They don't actually care about race in fandom, it's just about proving their own fandom credentials, and ultimately they're damaging any discussion that actually does focus on race issues.
It'd be nice if they did show up on the DVD/Blu Ray, but I don't remember the AOU alternate character death scene showing up on that DVD, so I'm not getting my hopes up. The MCU special features get crappier with every new release.
Come join us racists!
Though I haven't seen that thrown at Rey/Ren shippers, probably because there's so much else being lobbed their way. Or has that calmed down?
Though I haven't seen that thrown at Rey/Ren shippers, probably because there's so much else being lobbed their way. Or has that calmed down?
OP here
I actually meant it in a power way instead of a physical positioning/who is being penetrated way, but honestly the discussion that spiraled off of this was more interesting than what would have happened had I been more discerning with my phrasing.
I actually meant it in a power way instead of a physical positioning/who is being penetrated way, but honestly the discussion that spiraled off of this was more interesting than what would have happened had I been more discerning with my phrasing.
You lost me when you called some things overly "PC".
I'm an avid Yuletide writer and the rules explicitly say that Yuletide requests are only suggestions and that writers should write a fic that they like first before trying to add in all of the things their recipient will like, because the writer's enjoyment is key to a good fic and the focus of Yuletide is more about producing quality fic rather than totally customized fic.
Interesting how different our approaches are even for the same challenge.
Interesting how different our approaches are even for the same challenge.
I reeeeally can't see them giving the shield to Sharon. As much as I love her, she was such a small part of Winter Soldier's plot, and casual fans probably wouldn't even recognise who she is because she doesn't (in the films) have a cool superhero name or uniform. I'd imagine that's a red herring, like you say, or somebody's hopeful speculation being repeated so much it becomes a rumour.
I think it'll be Bucky, honestly. SebStan's got a pretty long contract, if I remember, and he's been an integral part of Steve's story since The First Avenger. I'd love it to be Sam, but it actually makes sense in terms of the movies for it to be Bucky. In the comics, there are countless legacy characters and people switching superhero names, but that's not a big thing in the MCU. (The closest thing would be Scott taking on the Ant-Man mantle, and the general public aren't even supposed to know Ant-Man existed.) Sam has his own strong identity as the Falcon in the movies, but after the events of Winter Soldier, Bucky doesn't have his own identity as a superhero (and is still struggling with his personal identity, I'd imagine). Having him become Cap gives him that identity.
I think it'll be Bucky, honestly. SebStan's got a pretty long contract, if I remember, and he's been an integral part of Steve's story since The First Avenger. I'd love it to be Sam, but it actually makes sense in terms of the movies for it to be Bucky. In the comics, there are countless legacy characters and people switching superhero names, but that's not a big thing in the MCU. (The closest thing would be Scott taking on the Ant-Man mantle, and the general public aren't even supposed to know Ant-Man existed.) Sam has his own strong identity as the Falcon in the movies, but after the events of Winter Soldier, Bucky doesn't have his own identity as a superhero (and is still struggling with his personal identity, I'd imagine). Having him become Cap gives him that identity.
And write an entire apology for having offended them. I felt horrible for the author because their writing was amazing and I appreciate someone taking what is usually an excuse for shameless smut, and tacking it more seriously (feel the same about ABO).
They started yelling at the author that they were a racist and hurting people with their portrayal of Finn as the aggressor (even though the story made it obvious Finn was under the influence of sex pollen and had no control and was as much a victim as Poe was, even Poe tells him so) and they should be ashamed of themselves.
Ironically by their own admission, the people attacking the author were white. And hen real POC like me pointed out there was nothing racist about the story, we were told to shut up because we didn't understand "white privilege".
Exactly. They don't care about race. They just care about getting brownie points because, damn, they are shipping two minorities together?????
While I ship Stormpilot like FedEx, I am currently writing Hux/Finn and Kylo/Finn stories and I am just waiting for one of them to come my way about being racist, just so I can delete their asses.
They started yelling at the author that they were a racist and hurting people with their portrayal of Finn as the aggressor (even though the story made it obvious Finn was under the influence of sex pollen and had no control and was as much a victim as Poe was, even Poe tells him so) and they should be ashamed of themselves.
Ironically by their own admission, the people attacking the author were white. And hen real POC like me pointed out there was nothing racist about the story, we were told to shut up because we didn't understand "white privilege".
Exactly. They don't care about race. They just care about getting brownie points because, damn, they are shipping two minorities together?????
While I ship Stormpilot like FedEx, I am currently writing Hux/Finn and Kylo/Finn stories and I am just waiting for one of them to come my way about being racist, just so I can delete their asses.
DA
You know, I think you might be onto something there with the Sam Wilson analogy. I know exactly teh type of people you're talking about.
That said though, for the record, I've written about five extremely angsty and/or dark fics for Poe/Finn, some of them sexually explicit or torturing Finn, and I've gotten nothing but good responses and zero hate on tumblr. So it might also be in the execution sometimes.
You know, I think you might be onto something there with the Sam Wilson analogy. I know exactly teh type of people you're talking about.
That said though, for the record, I've written about five extremely angsty and/or dark fics for Poe/Finn, some of them sexually explicit or torturing Finn, and I've gotten nothing but good responses and zero hate on tumblr. So it might also be in the execution sometimes.
I don't follow Rey/Ren stories, so I don't know if they are targeting those authors too. I just know I have been part of fandom for over 10 years and this has been the most PC and annoying fandom I have seen. And I was in the freaking HETALIA fandom.
THAT FANDOM HAD ACTUAL-NOT-SPACE-NAZIS STORIES!
THAT FANDOM HAD ACTUAL-NOT-SPACE-NAZIS STORIES!
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