tfa_kink | DISCUSSION/OFF-TOPIC POST

Again, it's not all of Tumblr. It's great that you follow the people who aren't misusing social justice issues to ship bash and shame. The tumblrites you follow are likely not the "Tumblr SJWs" mentioned above.

And you're still not listening.

Are you sure you are?

Very much and you are still derailing the conversation. Whenever the intention or not whenever people bring out the racist/sexist arguments they are immediately attacked for being "Tumblr SJW" and even gleefully talk about going out of their way to ship something they know people have rightful issues with, even though many of us are minorities and women.

Then when pointed out you want to act that you only meant the "Tumblr SJW", even though, no, people are talking about everyone who dares to mention these issues.

Yes this fandom has many issues from all sides, screaming "EVIL SJW" and pettiness is as much a problem as those people.

(As a latina I have witnessed a lot of gross stuff from Reylo, FinnRey and Stormpilot fans and I would like to be able to discuss it without being told to go back to Tumblr.)

uh huh.

DA

People can ship what they want, for whatever reasons they want, whether you or anyone else has issues with it, or not.

You have the right to bring up your issues with ships. Others have the right to listen or to ignore as they see fit.

Once you start telling Reylo shippers that they're rapists, or Kylux shippers that they only ship it for the whitecock, then and only then do you become one of the people we have been objecting to on this thread.

sorry, deleted my previous comment, because I forgot to log out! "You have the right to bring up your issues with ships. Others have the right to listen or to ignore as they see fit." this is really a great sentence! (if someone could show me, how to make quotes, while being logged out, that would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!)

+1

Some women and minorities can have rightful issues with a pairing. Other women and minorities, however, can have equally rightful reasons for shipping that pairing. Live and let live.

And I did that in my post where?

You didn't, that is the point. Jesus Christ. You were telling us that we were complaining about all "SJWs", we were saying that no, on the contrary, we were only complaining about people who are unreasonable about their hatred of other ships. The above is an example of the kind of thing we are discussing, not a specific accusation about you, random anonymous stranger, FFS.

I don't understand why you keep deliberately(?) misinterpreting Every. Single. Comment, unless you're hoping to start some kind of fight? As it is, you're clearly not the people we are talking about, so stop trying to claim that you are.

There's at least 2, maybe 3, people in this thread line who are pro-tumblr, so no single person keeps 'misinterpreting' your comments. I don't know if there's just one of you who keeps saying 'no, I mean the other tumblr people.'

The thing is that there isn't a clear good versus bad tumblr social justice line. There are people into social justice who are also into fandom. Some of these people are annoyed that every time there is a woman or black character they are dismissed as boring or not as interesting as two white male characters who become the fandom favorite and get the most fanfiction written about them.

That doesn't necessarily mean being against the ship and people who ship it, but it sometimes becomes that way, especially through interactions like this.

For example I'm a huge multi shipper. I write FinnPoe the most, but I've written a wide range of pairings. I wrote a couple of Kylux fics. But interacting with people, like in this thread, who dismiss people who have any critical view of fandom as tumblr sjws, or the people who go on and on about how boring Finn is compared to characters like Hux has made me no longer ship Kylux. I don't want to hang with those people. It's not the fact that people ship it that is annoying. It's that these people are so defensive of their ship and say shit like 'I guess I'm a skinhead then' or try and explain how Hux didn't actually commit genocide. People proudly say they are going to ship already dominate white pairings just 'to spite' those nasty sjws. Every single page of this discussion is filled with at least two or three of you explaining why FinnPoe and Rey in general just aren't interesting and justifying why Kylux is the only interesting pairing. There's opinions and then there's larger trends that happen across fandoms. People get sick of it. I know I am.

I'm not someone who writes about stuff like this on tumblr. I don't make posts about pairings I don't like. But I still am aware of what's going on and am critical of it. I still don't like most of this fandom because of people who think being critical of media and fandom trends is some sort of attack on their freedom.

So I am probably who you are talking about, actually caring about social justice aside.

There's opinions and then there's larger trends that happen across fandoms. People get sick of it. I know I am.

It's kinda funny that it always comes down to this on both ends of the spectrum.

+1

I think there is a pretty clear line, tbh. It's the one the various people in this thread have been drawing, and it goes something like this:

- Have an opinion on fandom's lack of interest in female characters? Fine.
- Harass, bully, call names or send anonhate to those who dislike a female character? No.

- Say you find fandom's interest in minor white characters over major characters of color worrying? Fine.
- Tell people who ship Kylux or like Mitaka that they are disgusting racists? No.

- Say you find certain het ships problematic? Fine.
- Tell 14 year old girls on Tumblr that they are rape-apologists and potential abusers, and that they need to disclose whether they have been sexually assaulted before they can ship Reylo? No.

The issue was only ever with name-calling, bullying and harassment, right from the start. I have no problem with discussion.

+9billion, jesus christmas

(not anon you replied to)

Can you see/admit how there might be grey area with some of those, though? For example, if someone is really frustrated about racism in how fandom treats characters and they call somebody a racist, saying that's "name-calling" when to them that's "correctly labelling" makes them think you are defending the racism or the racists.

nayrt

I'm almost hoping you're trolling with this response to the ayrt. Did you even read what you're responding to? Please state exactly where you think the 'grey area' is that makes option 2 acceptable in any of the mentioned cases.

In the cases where people don't think of "racist" as a "name" so much as a description of actions. We can't treat people's hurt feelings over being called racist as being equally important over people's hurt feelings over racial discrimination.

smh

You still do not understand what's being said at all. I give up.

Have you ever tried actually reading the comments you respond to? It's fun, and it gives you a better chance of not looking stupid on the internet.

AYRT

Well, obviously, if someone is being racist, saying racist things or supporting racist attitudes, then of course calling them out on it, which may involve telling them they are being racist, is more than acceptable.

However, if you read my comment, that it's not what I am talking about.

I'm not sure how much clearer I can make this, but here goes:

- if someone ships Kylux and is also simultaneously being a disgusting racist, telling them they are being a disgusting racist is fine. Obviously.

- if someone is happily going about shipping Kylux, and, based solely on who they ship, you tell them they are a disgusting racist, that is very much not fine.

I hope the general principle of not calling people disgusting racists when they're not being disgusting racists is clear at this point.

Exactly this.

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